A term to never use,,,,on slope and off slope!!

My point is that teaching plowing will cause later issues to intermediate level skiers, Just watch this winter as an intermediate skier approaches a "stressful" section ! Back to snow plow !!!!

I think you have a point Pavel. Speaking as the worst ski student EVER (4 weeks and still haven't got it!) I find myself refusing to completely let go of the old plow, like a drowning person clutching a straw. Especially if I get out of my comfort zone. But, I am determined to move on :roll:

I will get it eventually!

Allie

pavelski wrote:

My point is that teaching plowing will cause later issues to intermediate level skiers, Just watch this winter as an intermediate skier approaches a "stressful" section ! Back to snow plow !!!!

And what's the problem with that? A snowplough or stem turn can be most useful on narrow tracks, in an emergency, on a steep slope that tests your ability and confidence.

Properly executed snow ploughs do not involve sitting back. They have been a fundamental building block for teaching ski technique for decades and still have a part to play.

And back in the 1970s, US ski team coach Warren Weatherill used to take racers on runs where they were permitted to do nothing but snowploughs. It improved their carving, ankle flexion and hip and knee angles, apparently!

It is not that the snowplough is not a useful skill, but the detrimental effect it has on a beginner skier's progression. As Pavel says, the terrain that can be covered as a beginner without a snowplough is restricted, but overall progress to good skiing technique will be better with a more parallel approach. The issue I think for ski schools is whether to give people what they want (to get out skiing a lot of terrain as quickly as possible), or what is best for their long term skiing development.

Yes, the terrain that can be covered with the snowplough will be restricted. However, that will be true for just about every beginner, until a) they start to get use to some gentle speed, and b) they can remain in control.

My prime key issue would be safety and control. Once the pupil can operate control, they can move on to a parallel technique.

The key issue remains in retaining control, but they are now using a different technique, and can move on to more challenging terrain. They can do so with more confidence than otherwise ~ simply because someone has showed them a way to stay in control.

Now they will have confidence in their teacher ~ it worked before, so now I will trust you to show me more.

Skiing at all stages is not just about a chosen technique ~ it is as much about psychology and belief.

I once spent some time with a J2skier who was on her first visit to the mountains after a serious knee op. We just gently came down a T-bar run, plough turns, gradually narrowing the plough, until she was comfortably back with a controlled parallel turn.

What I din't tell her, until we had completed several runs, was that I was also narrowing the run. She called me a name, and then smiled! Later that day, she skied down the mountain.

Psychology, innit!!!!

Not a great fan of snowplough but I have been known to use this on the dryslopes to stop me from going head over heels.

Interesting topic this.
My first week on skis, Dec 2001, was for 3 days the most horrendous experience of my life, and I was ready to kill the instructor until he introduced us to parallel turns on day 4, and my life suddenly turned rosey and took off onto a new adventure.
Personally, I hated snow ploughing, and never wanted to use it ever again. But there have been times when it has been invaluable. For instance coming down a track behind other people, no width to turn, so snow plough comes in handy.
I do also see what Pav means about affecting timid intermediates as once a stressful situation arises they revert, in some cases.
My mates GF is a great example of someone who can ski properly, but gets so stressed that she uses snowploughing too often, and will not let her skis run faster than 4mph. Shame, as technically she is fine.
My other mate and his GF have also found it hard to leave the snowplough behind especially on steeper slopes, ie stressful situations. I noticed how both of them find it easy to bring at least one of the skis (usually the downhill one) into the snowplough position when they think they're going too fast for example. I have tried to encourage both of them to wipe it out of their habits, and they are getting their now, but it seems to be their "comfort blanket" at times, and I tend to put it down to laziness in the turn.

Personally, I dont think you can say its wrong or right. I was taught it in order to control my speed and be able to change direction, which I struggled to manage. Then as soon as I had been taught that, I was taught to ski a totally different way which I could manage. However, without that initial feeling of being in (kind of) control, I am not sure I or many others would have ever progressed.

Put it like this......stopping snow ploughing on day 4 of my first week certainly saved the life of 1 ESF instructor anyway.

Guilty as charged, Pavel. I used the term to give an idea of my daughter's skiing ability. No doubt she will move onto something more parallel this year - she is strong, athletic, and has a good sense of balance. However, I think that snowplough can be good for kids because they can control their speed easily, especially given that they tend to have more flexibility in their hips, knees and ankles which allows them to have a very wide plough with good edging capability for stopping. Me, I hate snowplough......

Cheers

Dobby

The big problem is with small kids as they seem to think they can assume snowplough position and simply charge down a slope without making a single turn. I've seen many an anxious parent skiing after a runaway 6 year old with skis pointing at each other.