What skis are right for me?

Neiltoo wrote:

I think that you have a very narrow view of what carving is, Trencher.
Nothing wrong with that, but it results in people disagreeing with you )
In my opinion, carving is what the ski does, not what the skier does. There are many ways to get the ski to carve (body position wise) and many ways to balance on the ski while it carves.
So if someones body shape/position doesn't conform to what you see as carving then its not carving :D

I actually made reference to that above when I said " Just because there is extreme angulation and inclination of the skis, the skis still may not be carving." refering to the pictures and video of the stright skis in use by experts. I totally agree with you Neil, carving is about how the ski cuts an arc through the snow. The critical part of this is that no part of the ski should be skidding. If it is, then energy is being lost and ski is not carving cleanly.

So yes I do think there is a difference in definition here. It is because what was accepted as a carved turn on old school skis, no longer meets the standard commonly achieved and that is a clean, no skid at all turn.

Trencher

RossF wrote:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DtB5SW7HYyY&feature=related

Try telling Kaiser he is not carving...

My all time hero, no not you Ross I mean Franz :mrgreen:

It would be perfectly understandable either way but thank you for being clear :wink:

RossF wrote:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DtB5SW7HYyY&feature=related

Try telling Kaiser he is not carving...

The guy is a skiing god, but compare that to a modern DH where they do carve. A better view of what his skis were doing here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I9GG02RvV0Y&feature=related Slomo the turns between 30 and 40 secs.

I said befor that DH is so far removed from everyday skiing as to be irrelevent. Do you know anyone who skis over 140 kph off a closed DH race course ?

What I would really like to see is a non racer carving on old skis. It's hard to believe that if this was possible by most expert skiers, there is no visual record of it.

Trencher

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Othp2ignRrU&feature=related

As required. I think the answer may lie in the definition of the word carving and clarity may be made of each others posts through different definitions of the word 'carving' as seen by each poster.

ise wrote:

It's the days before Youtube and digital cameras, there's no doubt material but I can't be bothered to hunt around for something just because you demand it because it won't make a blind bit of difference to you. People could and did carve with older skis, it's a fact as you know, so I don't even understand why we're supposed to be providing proof unless you're really saying it's impossible?

Ok, I'm saying it's impossible to carve linked, clean, no skid at all turns on skinny skis with 6/7mm sidecuts without making each turn the length of a football pitch or so shallow as to be hardly a turn at all.

Trencher

OK, I see, that's much simpler. In fact your idea of what sidecuts were is incorrect as well, late 80's or so side-cuts of skis would be over 10mm anyway. You might also read the Mark Elling book who talks about carving on slightly older skis.

RossF wrote:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Othp2ignRrU&feature=related

As required. I think the answer may lie in the definition of the word carving and clarity may be made of each others posts through different definitions of the word 'carving' as seen by each poster.

If part of the ski is skidding, is it a carved turn, a partially carved turn or an old school carved turn ? The term is fixed by current usage and today that means no element of skidding by any part of the ski or at any point in the turn or between the turns. If people talked about "what we used to call carving" or old school carving, it would differentiate the term from the current usage.

Trencher