Good, used, cheap beginner ski

bandit wrote:It's worth remembering that every ski ever made is a carving ski.

That may be, but until more recently 99.9% of skiers could not carve. A lot of them thought they were carving as they sprayed snow from their skidded turns, but that wasn't carving.

Even the very best racers were not making solid carves with little skidding on virtually straight sticks. Just compare these best of their era skiers on slalom courses. Even the very best technique is not going to make a virtually straight ski carve well. Would be interesting to get an opinion from the horses mouth on this though )


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_U2auRoUMoI&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4EJSR1DjEhI&feature=related



Trencher

Let me re-phrase my comment )

Every ski ever made has the ability to make a carved turn. It's down to the skier and their "choice"
)
I would suggest that the footage of Stenmark shows him backing off the edges, in order to get the tightest line.

Trencher, not everyone is interested in doing carving, as the goal. I know this is true for me. I see it as one of the techniques, and I'll use it when it seems appropriate, and I'd certainly not want to spend my time making big carved turns on machine groomed slopes, there is too much else to go ski. Each to their own, it's a varied sport :D

bandit wrote:.

Trencher, not everyone is interested in doing carving, as the goal. I know this is true for me. I see it as one of the techniques, and I'll use it when it seems appropriate, and I'd certainly not want to spend my time making big carved turns on machine groomed slopes, there is too much else to go ski. Each to their own, it's a varied sport :D

I understand that and to each, their own ofcourse. The reality is though that most skiers spend most of their time on those groomed slopes and many would like to be able to carve on skis or at least feel smooth on them. It is much harder to relearn basic technique in order to make use of modern skis with sidecuts than it is to start out with that skill set.

Trencher

Skiing is/was "easy" to me, on skis that were completely straight (the only kind I have ever skied on). I commonly hear how much easier the "new" ski design is to ski on. But the way everyone is talking here (and some other posts) makes it sound like it is a lot more complicated. Before, I just got on my skis and skied, now I have to worry about am I carving or not or am I doing this right or not? It is really sounding confusing.

Also I plan on giving my son a few basic lessons (how to stay upright & snow plow etc) then getting him some professional lessons. After he has a good understanding from Professional lessons I can help him build on that. Also I may take a few lessons my self, but my boss (1 of the people I will be skiing with a lot) has been skiing continuously for the last 20/30+ years and also is friends with and skis with a lot of the ski patrol and some very good skiers that could probably give me all the hints/training I need.

Make the lessons you get your son the ones he starts with to give him a good base to start with. Bad habits earned when learning will be carried through his skiing otherwise.

From self assessment things I am not so great at when skiing at full speed are evident when I take it right back to a wedge turn.

brad1138 wrote:Skiing is/was "easy" to me, on skis that were completely straight (the only kind I have ever skied on). I commonly hear how much easier the "new" ski design is to ski on. But the way everyone is talking here (and some other posts) makes it sound like it is a lot more complicated. Before, I just got on my skis and skied, now I have to worry about am I carving or not or am I doing this right or not? It is really sounding confusing.

I can quite understand why it all reads as confusing. It's quite possible for novice skiers on new style equipment to be skiing black runs (single diamonds) after a week. Think back to when you were a learner on skinny skis, how many days for you?

Some US centres no longer teach the snowplough, learners go straight to parallel turns. Remember your snowploughing (wedge) lessons?

To get the best from the new kit, bring yourself up to date with a private lesson from a pro.
Give your son the best start by getting him good kit to ski on and the best lessons you can afford. He will thank you later, or you can make him work off the costs )

not everyone is interested in doing carving, as the goal. I know this is true for me. I see it as one of the techniques, and I'll use it when it seems appropriate, and I'd certainly not want to spend my time making big carved turns on machine groomed slopes, there is too much else to go ski.

I am a bit confused. GF learnt to ski the old way, and told me I should learn to control speed by using short quick turns. She said that is my next goal now I can ski parallel on blue slopes. She has almost new carving skis (with releasable-heel bindings for touring). But I only ever see her doing these short wiggling turns ('weddeln' in German). So I asked her, Why do you have carving skis then, if you don't carve?' She said, 'Oh, I do carve if I go somewhere steeper and it is not so busy and it is safe to go fast. That is how I prefer to ski. But it is not suitable here.'

So is she wrong about not carving on a slope full of inexperienced skiiers, where it is not safe to go fast? Or is carving now also good for well-controlled slow skiing?

And is it important to get modern wider shorter skis (or even wider long skis?) if you are not going to be carving?

Incidentally my old skis are called Pro-carve, although they are fairly narrow, so the designers obviously thought they were suitable for carving in their day.

Trencher wrote:

Which is better, to be first to the bottom or pull some Gs through some fast turns?

To be first to the bottom.

Every time. :wink: