Too late for me - please sort out my sons future

Here I am in the UK, on the web, checking out anything to do with skiing and the mountains dozens of times a day, whilst working in an industry being crucified by the downturn, wondering why I made the decisions that got me here, and salivating at the prospect of just 1 week of skiing this year.

Now, I know it's too late for me, with all the responsibilities I'm now encumbered with, but my snowboarding mad 16 year old son, could forego the 'rat race' when he leave school in 2 years time, and wants to do something ( in fact not just something, but a career) that means he gets to live and work in the mountains.

What careers ( not in the 'rat race') can he pursue that means he gets to live and work in the mountains, whilst earning enough to aspire to marriage, children, maybe buying a flat/house.

Anyone currently ' living the dream' - how did you manage it?


Graham

hymac580 wrote:Here I am in the UK, on the web, checking out anything to do with skiing and the mountains dozens of times a day, whilst working in an industry being crucified by the downturn, wondering why I made the decisions that got me here, and salivating at the prospect of just 1 week of skiing this year.

Now, I know it's too late for me, with all the responsibilities I'm now encumbered with, but my snowboarding mad 16 year old son, could forego the 'rat race' when he leave school in 2 years time, and wants to do something ( in fact not just something, but a career) that means he gets to live and work in the mountains.

What careers ( not in the 'rat race') can he pursue that means he gets to live and work in the mountains, whilst earning enough to aspire to marriage, children, maybe buying a flat/house.

Anyone currently ' living the dream' - how did you manage it?


Graham

Is snowboarding all he does? You really need a range of qualifications to get work all year around and actually live, even then working for someone else full-time or freelance really isn't going to pay so well in my opinion.

When he leaves school, if he wants to be a professional, he might still find University useful which will also provide chances for trips and to build experience.

Another option is just do an ordinary job but do it close to the mountains, it's always a way to build money to buy property and be financially secure before being a full-time outdoor professional. I know teachers for example who work in international schools here who do a lot of outdoor work with the schools and get paid to take additional NQB's.

The key word though is professional, he needs qualifications and loads of them really. Just being a snowsports instructor unless you're at the very, very top level doesn't pay so much and it's hard to work all year around. The other point, or a mistake to potentially avoid, is to ask if you want to merge your hobby and work, after-all what would you do on your day off? You can still work in the mountains but leave your hobby for your time off, just a thought!


How serious is he?

Having a 'trade' might be the key. We had a Dutch ski instructor in Les Arcs once who was a qualified mechanical engineer and he spent the summer maintaining the lift infrastructure and the winter instructing. Seemed like a nice balance to me.

mtr259 wrote:Having a 'trade' might be the key. We had a Dutch ski instructor in Les Arcs once who was a qualified mechanical engineer and he spent the summer maintaining the lift infrastructure and the winter instructing. Seemed like a nice balance to me.

depends how you view that really, what I read underlines my point that just being a snow-sports instructor isn't a full-time year round job. There's nothing wrong with that approach but you'd need to ask some questions, like, how long you're going to be doing it. Or just how much summer work he really gets, Arcs close the lifts in late April and reopen around December, is he really working from May to Nov on maintenance? It seems a bit unlikely to me based on what I see, more likely I'd expect a fixed contract of a few weeks. In the winter I'd be asking if he works for a ski school or not and just how much that really pays and the basis of the contract with them, is he paid just when he works or is it salaried? etc etc

There's probably three categories to think of, first, those who have a lifestyle that breaks even which is great while it lasts but no one wants to retire penniless, second, those who did something else for 20 or 30 years and bought their way in with a hotel or business etc, and third, those who've actually made a real career of it. I'd reckon you want to be in the last two groups at least really. You can mix and match obviously.

I'd underline though what I already said, long term I don't believe you're going to make a good living in the outdoors working for other people or at the least it's pretty exceptional..

I agree very much with what Ise has said. I spent a wonderful 15 years working in the alps and the rockies. Whilst I enjoyed every minute of it I often struggled to support myself, I certainly couldnt have contemplated having a family etc. I did many jobs, teaching , working for tour operators, barman, cleaning apartements etc.

Even at a managerial level with a tour operator I was not making enough money to support a family (the next step up usually involves working in an office - defeating the purpose!)

My aim was to ski as much as possible. Except for when I was teaching I pretty much skied (for me) 5 days a week for 10 or 11 years. I'm sure I gave up some pretty good opportunities because I just wanted to ski all the time but that was my choice.

I think a gap year spent working in a ski resort (doing any job) is a great way of finding out what goes on, seeing what opportunities there are and then making plans based on that. Most ski resorts are communities which require all the usual services and skills which you would find in any small town.

Most of the people I know who are 'living the dream' have either been lucky (right place, right time) or have started their own business and been successful or have a skill that is in demand.

I could have kept teaching and maybe I would have got to a stage where I could have made a reasonable living but I loved teaching/didnt like working for ski schools and instructors don't get a lot of time to ski for themselves.

A second language is a huge advantage [assuming they speak it where you are working ) ]

ise wrote:[
There's probably three categories to think of, first, those who have a lifestyle that breaks even which is great while it lasts but no one wants to retire penniless, second, those who did something else for 20 or 30 years and bought their way in with a hotel or business etc, and third, those who've actually made a real career of it. I'd reckon you want to be in the last two groups at least really. You can mix and match obviously.

..

I realise I'm asking the impossible. I agree with Ise about the 3 categories. Category 2 is where i find myself, but unable to untangle my current life to pursue the mountains.

I'd like my lad to fall in category 3.

Very dissappointed to here from Neiltoo, that even at management level, one can't earn enough to 'settle down'.

Bearing in mind the fortunes we fork out for snow hols, surprising that proper livings can't be earned.

Neiltoo wrote:
I think a gap year spent working in a ski resort (doing any job) is a great way of finding out what goes on, seeing what opportunities there are and then making plans based on that. Most ski resorts are communities which require all the usual services and skills which you would find in any small town.

I have to be candid and say for me it's possibly a waste of a year ) I don't accept the principle of doing something you like for a while before going to do something else you don't like :D It's a bit like the condemned mans last breakfast to me. Hopefully Ross might weight in (and Benny?) with their gap year experiences taking qualifications, it's a gap year if you want or it's the foundation for a career.

Neiltoo wrote:A second language is a huge advantage [assuming they speak it where you are working ) ]

Yes, or two or three preferably, I meant to mention that and forgot.

Another thought, something I'm not recommending or promoting but just an option, is the Armed Forces route. A lot of people have gone this way and the forces have set them up via internal paths like JSML for a career in the outdoors. Former forces personnel are much sought after for some work.

hymac580 wrote:Very dissappointed to here from Neiltoo, that even at management level, one can't earn enough to 'settle down'.

hopefully I'm not going to offend Neil here :oops: If your lad wants a career then he needs qualifications, the reason working with tour companies doesn't pay too well is that anyone can do it for a few years and it keeps rates down. There's no good reason a young person can't build a career in the outdoor industry but they'll need to be every bit as committed to it as becoming, for example, an accountant and work just as hard at it. In the end the financial rewards aren't great but the lifestyle should be good and I do beleive you can live on it. In fact, one route is to build a business of your own and that's just as hard in the outdoors as the antique business or car repair etc.

He'll need to start quick though, it can take years to gain the experience for the elite level qualifications it's no surprise the average ages of guides, leaders etc. is into 30's and 40's you need a lot of experience, the technical skills are almost the easy bit really.

hymac580 wrote:

Very dissappointed to here from Neiltoo, that even at management level, one can't earn enough to 'settle down'.

I'm quite sure that it is possible, but I cant see one getting much time to ski.

Ise, I have a very thick skin ) and besides I agree with you. The standard of some of the people working in the travel industry is dreadful. Peanuts and monkeys comes to mind!

Possibly the term 'gap year' isnt quite right but I think its a good idea to see what life is like in a ski resort without having to give too much up to see if you like it.

I have a number of friends who went the armed forces route and it seems to have worked out well for them.