Is it just me?

Sorry about this, but you DIYers are delusional.

When you add up all the costs it is almost impossible to beat the package prices.

The last few years, in my view, have seen a huge reduction in ski holiday availability, with holiday companies reducing their exposure due to lack of demand caused by the 'recession'. They have retreated to their core market, the people unaffected, and know that they can pretty much keep the prices fairly high in that sector.

This has seen real 'late deals' dry up in the last couple of years.

However, in my experience, there is a window around the end of October when companies get twitchy prior to the arrival of the snow, and if you are prepared to take a chance, then that is the time, again, in my view, to book.

Bad times for the skier, but still, on the whole, better to take a package, where the TO has negotiated with the hotel/chalet, than to DIY as a 'punter'.

I disagree, Brucie. If I choose to, I can do Edinburgh/Munich/train Skiwelt/Wildschoenau/ Alpbachtal, Pension or HB, much cheaper than a TO. I use a TO when I am with family or a ski group, but always go diy when doing a solo, or just with my OH.

There are ways. You just have to get good at it. Oh, and when you find the way......You don't tell anyone how to do it!

I also disagree with Brucie. Our 1st winter DIY trip was in 1992, and have gone the DIY route every winter since. We were unhappy with being treated like cattle, and always being in a queue.We also wanted to make our own packages, with the savings that brings. We have been package tourists since, when skiing in the USA. The experiences served to reinforce our views.

I also have to disagree Brucie.

DIY'ing is not always about saving money, but about making sure you get what you want.

Having said that, I have been able to beat TO prices on many occasions by going direct. An example was one I looked at earlier this year, the brochure price was £1400 pp. I visited the hotel website and could have booked the rooms direct at £700 pp. Exactly the same service, half board, and the same room types. It would have cost us £500 per vehicle going (x2) with 3 people in each vehicle. Cost of trip DIY = £867 pp, only thing missing is no resort rep.

We did not book it due to other reasons (namely an idiot son of the guy I go with decided to get married that weekend :shock: ), but I doubt the price would have fallen to the level we could have got it for.

Brucie,
I wouldn't say I can always beat the package price, but quite often I can, and if I can't actually beat it on price I can find much nicer accommodation and a far more comfortable way of getting there than the TO is offering.

I beat the TO total package price for my New Year 2011/2012 ski holiday to Meribel by miles. In fact, we paid about half the amount per person that we would have paid if we'd gone with, say, Crystal or Inghams.

There were 3 of us and we travelled out on the day Eurostar and back in the luxury seats on the night train (which is something you can't do if you book through a TO - or at least I haven't found one I can do that with). We did this so that we could get 7 days ski-ing.

We stayed in Maeva Les Ravines, a self-catering apartment for 4 people. And we got a taxi from Moutiers to Meribel on the way out, and the bus on the way back.

I'm pretty sure I paid £179 each for our return train tickets, and only £750 for the apartment with Pierre et Vacances because I got it as an accommodation only offer through Igluski who got if from IfyouSki. These were bargain prices that I only got because I booked the instant the train and the apartment became available. I've forgotten what the taxi cost, but I know the bus was 15 euros return.

So, total per person was £250 for the apartment, £179 for the train, say £15 for the bus.
Thus total for accommodation, transport and transfers was only £444.
The TO's were asking about £1000 per person for this exact same holiday. And even if we'd flown they still wanted about £900 per person.

Actually, I've just checked, and Crystal are asking £1026 for it this year, over New Year, with train tickets (day train both ways) for 3 people, or £929 p.p. if you fly.

And P&V are asking 1450 euros (full price) which works out about £1160, or £386 p.p. Obviously all the cheap train tickets have gone now, but I suppose I would have been able to get them at £179 again. So I could have bought that holiday again this year (with the apartment at full price this time) for £580 including £15 for the bus.

And I decided to deal directly with the chalet owners for the 2013 J2Ski group holiday I'm organizing because I could get a more suitable deal for us.

I phoned several TO's and was shocked to hear that they would charge group members who wanted solo accommodation the full price of the holiday less about £60 for the flights on top of the basic holiday cost - so say another £500 on top of the original £560 or so. And we have several group members who want sole occupancy of their room. Bonjour are only charging us a £200 surcharge for this.

Furthermore, the chalet owners have allowed one of us to book into a triple room without a surcharge on the understanding that they will try to find someone to share the room with him, as well as us, but if none of us find anyone then that particular person will have a triple room all to himself with no extra charge.

Sometimes the package deals with the TO's can be very cheap, because they do things like one child gets a totally free holiday - free flights, accommodation, ski hire and lessons. I noticed just now that Crystal are offering free first time ski and board packages. I suppose that's because they've realized that less first timers are going ski-ing /boarding and their customer base will diminish unless they can do something about it.

Far Queue wrote:I also have to disagree Brucie.
DIY'ing is not always about saving money, but about making sure you get what you want.

I agree with Far Queue and I also agree with Ally
Have DIY'ed in the Feb half term for the last 5 years and although each year it gets a little more expensive as we start to want to be nearer and nearer the piste and want a larger apartment with comfortable seating for all of us ( the Snowtrex chalets that we used to use only seem to have one sofa, even those saying sleep eight. We also always book something that sleeps 6-8 as everyone wants a bedroom- This time all have
our own bathroom.
So the breakdown per person for a weeks holiday in Morillon for 4 is as follows without food (For Feb half term 2013 )

Return flight from Luton to Geneva (inc.2 cases) £ 170
Petrol airport(return) £ 10
Parking Luton(mid term car park early booking deal) £ 13
Return Transfer Geneva to Morillon ( shared mini bus)
Usually hire car for 4 but friends coming later £ 64
Large 2 bed/2bath apartment right by piste
(incl linen andtowels) £ 258
ski and boot hire ( black/gold) online hire £ 65
ski pass £ 200
ski lessons £ 100

Total £ 880

Admittedly as no car this year food bill could be pricier but last year in Serre Cherre even though we had a car we shopped in local shops. To make it cheaper you could eat lunch in or take food with you. And as others have said take some food from home. If you don't mind being further from the piste and don't mind a smaller apartment then it can be done even cheaper.
It has taken a lot of shopping around to get these prices but I have looked at TO's and for a package of all travel + accommodation + ski hire + lessons, none can match this for a Feb half term.

Hiya,

I know it seems to be the attitude of " take 'em for everything they've got " but there are still cheaper alternatives I guess.....depending on when you go and if you have any kind of flexibility......you can still get return flights for most places at around £70 each, car hire £170 ish for a week ( or return transfer with say BensBus at about £73 each, normal transfer schedule buses roughly the same ) and if you don't mind self catering a weeks acommadation for around £300 - £400 p/w.

I find the killer is the Lift Pass price now for families I'm afraid, which now I think is the number 1 deciding factor for a family of 4, if the lift pass companies realized this they would drop thier prices , gain more visitors and therefore keep the same profit margins, whilst helping local businesses with the extra tourism .

jon.

Looks like this has turned into yet another thread where people make statements about the way they prefer to take a holiday being by far the best, ie packages vs DIY

If that's the case, I can only echo Brucie's post which is factually correct and not littered with personal preferences or emotional remarks from the odd bad experience possibly?

The recession has hit hard. Not just you and me, or other people who take skiing holidays, but property owners, businesses, restaurants, airlines, tour operators, etc.

Property being sold as holidays now via tour ops was reserved in previous years and booked when the euro exchange rate was at its very worse ie 1 to 1. Therefore, prices have increased and some resorts and accommodations have been binned. There's a market which keeps tour ops going so they are concentrating on that. Most people will find a way of making it happen if they really want to.

I've done both packages and DIY and enjoyed them all. Each has their positives and negatives. There is no right or wrong in either.

What I can say from experience is that the kind of holiday I want cannot be had anywhere as cost effectively by doing it myself. Flights, transfers to the door, catered accommodation close to lifts or pistes. It also depends where and when. But for me a weeks skiing all in including lift pass and spending money me always costs almost exactly £1000 each. That's good quality and out of peak weeks. It cannot be bettered on price for the same standard.
I've looked, believe me.

I've done DIY and booked my own flights one time and rented a car, or driven all the way. Both I've enjoyed ad have their advantages in terms of independence if you want to drive to other ski areas. Or taking more if you have your own car for instance.

However, do you really want to drive for hours?
Do you want the added hassle of potential breakdowns, road closures, snow chains, and all the extra expense of having the right tyres and other ancillary things you now need?

For me, getting to the uk airport and having everything sorted for me from there is just so easy. Some people think its like being herded around but it's never felt like that to me. I like the efficiency of getting a flight and then a coach direct to my accommodation. But each to their own.

I see pros and cons with both ways of taking your holiday. I think individuals will find what works for them financially and which way they prefer to travel.

This coming season brochure prices seem a bit steeper, yes. I've found the place I want to go including half board, flights, transfers, lift pass for £775 which is more than I often pay and still within my £1000 rough target price, but I have often found bargains by booking later. I am sure discounted deals will start to appear soon and people will find some great package deals.

But to answer nelly's original post, no it's not you, prices in brochures always seem high when you first see them!!!